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Front axle swap

  
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Front axle swap

 
flyingjeeps flyingjeeps
New User | Posts: 27 | Joined: 11/08
Posted: 07/01/09
07:49 PM

I have a Dana 30 in my tj that has bad u-joints.  It also is bent in the C on the end of the axle allowing my wheels to tip in too far on top.  Can't remember if that is positive or negative camber?  Anyway my question was what axle would be recommended that would be an upgrade and also would have manual lockout hubs so I can get away from the unit bearing?  Where do I start to look? I don't mind doing some fab work to get things set up as I do that for a winter job.  Like most people I would like to keep it as inexpensive as possible.  I was thinking if the u-joints are going bad, now would be as good a time as any to fix all the problems.  Thanks in advance.  

 
redsand723 redsand723
Enthusiast | Posts: 513 | Joined: 11/08
Posted: 07/02/09
03:00 AM

it dosent have manual hubs but a high pinion 30 out of a cherokee is a bolt in swap, and can be found pretty cheap, you will want a newer one that dosent have the c.a.d., the rubicon front axle uses a lot of parts from this axle-i think i read some where that a locker out of a tj will fit just fine but a different gearset must be used  
"WHEN IN DOUBT TACH IT OUT!"

 
flyingjeeps flyingjeeps
New User | Posts: 27 | Joined: 11/08
Posted: 07/02/09
12:35 PM

Ok. Exposing my ignorance even more, I can't figure out what the c.a.d. is that your talking about. Do you know what gears they normally have in them?  Mine are 3.73 but I've been thinking about regearing with the 33's and I want to be able to do it right the first time rather than several times.  Gets expensive.  

 
redsand723 redsand723
Enthusiast | Posts: 513 | Joined: 11/08
Posted: 07/02/09
03:42 PM

C.a.d.=central axle disconnect, not sure on gears avalable for stock  
"WHEN IN DOUBT TACH IT OUT!"

 
flyingjeeps flyingjeeps
New User | Posts: 27 | Joined: 11/08
Posted: 07/02/09
04:15 PM

Ok thanks.  I thought about running an offset ball joint and trying to beef up the c's a little until I can do more research into it and do it right.  Any other opinions out there?  

 
redsand723 redsand723
Enthusiast | Posts: 513 | Joined: 11/08
Posted: 07/02/09
06:09 PM

depends on how deep your pockets are, whats an off set ball joint?  
"WHEN IN DOUBT TACH IT OUT!"

 
flyingjeeps flyingjeeps
New User | Posts: 27 | Joined: 11/08
Posted: 07/02/09
07:41 PM

It's a ball joint that has the pin set to the one side so you can adjust the caster and camber depending on how you turn it.  I like your idea of the axle from an xj but would also like to be able to not have everything turning all the time cause it's my daily driver.  

 
redsand723 redsand723
Enthusiast | Posts: 513 | Joined: 11/08
Posted: 07/03/09
04:48 AM

im thinking about swapping in a cherokee 30, so i can keep my tru-track    mile marker and warn make a manual hub kit for the 30 but its pricey  
"WHEN IN DOUBT TACH IT OUT!"

 
flyingjeeps flyingjeeps
New User | Posts: 27 | Joined: 11/08
Posted: 07/03/09
07:27 AM

Yeah i've seen that kit.  Would like to do it but thought if I could swap one in with it already it might be better.  Maybe a D44.  I'm not sure where to start looking to know what fits n what doesn't.  

 
redsand723 redsand723
Enthusiast | Posts: 513 | Joined: 11/08
Posted: 07/03/09
01:32 PM

scout 44s are a popular swap, but you will have to have the brackets welded on, and the wheel bolt pattern is different  
"WHEN IN DOUBT TACH IT OUT!"

 
ftgiles ftgiles
Addict | Posts: 2178 | Joined: 05/08
Posted: 07/03/09
04:32 PM

A Scout is a passenger's side drop and the TJ is a driver's side drop. So if you're not swapping the t-case also, then it wouldn't be very popular. And the Scouts had external (weak) locking hubs and were set up to run with zero degrees caster. Wouldn't consider a Scout front axle for any project!

One of the easiest, least expensive, and more popular swaps into a TJ would be a front Dana 44 from an SJ Wagoneer. They were driver's side drop from '80-'91, but beware of the vacuum disconnect (CAD) used from '82-'84. They're almost exactly the same width as a TJ. But, there are a lot of brackets to weld on and the bracket kits cost around $300-$400. And then add in new bearings, calipers, rotors, ball joints, upper control arm bushings, and a gear swap, you'll be into the swap for way over a grand, plus the cost of the axle and time.

And notice I said least expensive.

You could swap in an XJ hi-pinion, but left with all stock parts, what are you really gaining? The axle shafts are puny (same size 27 spline shafts as the TJ Dana 30) and depending on the year of the XJ axle, may have even smaller u-joints than your TJ Dana 30.

Now, I have an XJ hi-pinion Dana 30 that I put a bunch of money into. It has 30 spline alloy shafts and Reid Racing knuckles that converts the XJ/TJ knuckle to run all full-size Dana 44 outers. That includes big brakes, hi-steer arms, and internal locking hubs. The strength of this build is probably a little stronger than a stock Rubicon Dana 44. The strength comes from the same size axle shafts, but are alloy (stronger), and a comparable ring gear strength because a hi-pinion is stronger than a low-pinion. The Rubicon Dana 44 is bigger but is low-pinion, so a hi-pinion 30 is about the same as a lo-pinion 44.

The weakness to all the TJ/XJ stuff, including the Rubicon, is really the axle tubes and the outers. The only difference between the XJ/TJ front axle and the Rubicon Dana 44 is the center section. The tubes and outers are identical.

This is where the Wagoneer axle can really outshine the XJ hi-pinion, because the tubes are thicker and of a larger diameter. Since yours is bent and you haven't broken an axle shaft or ring gear, I'm guessing you need housing strength, as well as internals strength.

There aren't any cheap options. By cheap, I mean a couple hundred dollars. Almost anything you swap in will cost you a grand and probably a lot more, by the time you're done. That is if you're truly upgrading. A worn out XJ hi-pinion is not an upgrade if you're not going to put some money into it.

You can get an XJ hi-pinion for a $100 if you look. And all day long for less than $200. For the same $200 or $300, you can also get a Wagoneer Dana 44. But, that's just the beginning.

You can convert your TJ to run lock out hubs and run bigger brakes for about $800. This would use the Reid racing knuckles and junk yard Dana 44 parts.

And let me tell you, the brake upgrade just by itself is worth every penny. Wow! But XJ/TJ stuff, no matter what you do, should really just be considered if your tire size is going to be 35" or less. Even the Wagoneer axle should be for 35's or less. If you want bigger than 35's, then you really need either a JK Dana 44 or a Dana 60.  

 
flyingjeeps flyingjeeps
New User | Posts: 27 | Joined: 11/08
Posted: 07/03/09
09:57 PM

Thanks.  Lots of things to think about.  I like learning about this stuff.  I may be wrong but isn't there a strength issue with the JK D44 as well?  Thought I read somewhere that the tubes were a bit weak?  I'll check into some of that stuff and go from there.  Thanks for the help.  

 
ftgiles ftgiles
Addict | Posts: 2178 | Joined: 05/08
Posted: 07/04/09
08:04 AM

Yes, the JK front does have a suspect connection between the inner knuckle and the axle tube. But that seems to be easily fixed with a little gusset.  

 
flyingjeeps flyingjeeps
New User | Posts: 27 | Joined: 11/08
Posted: 07/04/09
06:35 PM

Ok thanks a lot for the help guys.  

 
dayateez dayateez
New User | Posts: 1 | Joined: 07/09
Posted: 07/10/09
09:41 AM

What you have in your front axle is what I want to build. I understand the Ried knuckles use chevy spindles. What hub, bearings, rotor, disc brake set up did you use your front axle. I already have Alloy rear axles in the rear dana 44 with 5 on 5 1/2 bolt pattern so I will be going to the same on the front with lockouts. I am building a 2005 TJ unlimited with high line fenders and trimming in the rear, 1" body lift, 1" motor lift, flat tranfer case plate and 34's. I havent figured out how much lift I will need yet. What is the brake upgrade you wrote about.
Thanks for any help you can give me  

 
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