Chrysler continues to miss the mark(et)

The latest article about the Wrangler EV is just the latest evidence that Chrysler hasn't a clue. I wish to disclose that I live in the Metro-Detroit area and I am embarrassed at the detachment Chrysler has from its loyal Wrangler base.  Part of me thinks they should go out of business.

Nearly any Wrangler owner will tell you that the most coveted engine option for the Wrangler is that of the diesel.  And yet, Chrysler is tripping over themselves to push out an untested driveline with unknown battery availability and reliability to pacify rabid environmentalists and jump on the "GREEN" bandwagon. All this while loyal and current Wrangler owners wring their hands and scream to deaf ears "OFFER A DIESEL"! Now, Chrysler is crawling to the taxpayer for help because they cant sell enough cars...any wonder why?

They pretend to consider customer input. I myself wrote Chrysler a letter explaining my desire that they offer a diesel option and at the end requested that they do not send me a form-letter response, as I find them dismissive.  Guess what??? They sent me a form letter thanking me for my interest in the Jeep, and explained that they currently do not offer the diesel option. REALLY!?! I already KNEW that!

Chryler might deserve to go into the toilet. The desire for a diesel option is not hard to guage.  They ought to fire all of the people making product decisions at Jeep, and especially those in their research department.  Here's a hint: Google "Diesel Wrangler" for once, you shmucks.  

Diesel has become such a sexy buzz word.

People don't want diesel. They could care less about the fuel that actually goes into their vehicle. They don't want noisy engines, they don't want stinky dirty exhaust, they don't want expensive limited availability of fuel.

They want power, and they want fuel economy. There is a legitimate debate about how to deliver on these desires.

If the Wrangler had 300 hp and 300 ft lbs of torque and it was produced from a supercharged gasoline 4cyl that got 25 mpg, do you think that might make a lot of Wrangler owners happy?

And if that powertrain could also be used in more than just the Wrangler, don't you think that could help the bottom line for Chrysler? Which in turn might help future R&D for Wrangler products?

These would be the debates going on over at Chrysler. They think about diesel engines way more than most consumers ever do.

Letting a few consumers have too much input into the design process of a vehicle yields the Pontiac Aztec. Boy, they hit the mark there.  

ftgiles:
Diesel has become such a sexy buzz word.

People don't want diesel. They could care less about the fuel that actually goes into their vehicle. They don't want noisy engines, they don't want stinky dirty exhaust, they don't want expensive limited availability of fuel.

They want power, and they want fuel economy. There is a legitimate debate about how to deliver on these desires.

If the Wrangler had 300 hp and 300 ft lbs of torque and it was produced from a supercharged gasoline 4cyl that got 25 mpg, do you think that might make a lot of Wrangler owners happy?

And if that powertrain could also be used in more than just the Wrangler, don't you think that could help the bottom line for Chrysler? Which in turn might help future R&D for Wrangler products?

These would be the debates going on over at Chrysler. They think about diesel engines way more than most consumers ever do.

Plenty of people DO want diesel...obviously you are not one of them, but then, there are many other people in this country besides you. Your argument about "noisy" and "dirty" engines is extremely dated...based on the diesel engines from the 70's, 80's and first half of 90's.  Today's diesel engines burn extremely efficiently and now use low-sulfer fuel.  I dare say that the newest diesels probably burn cleaner than many gasoline engines.  I will concede that diesel is more expensive than in the past, however.

You say people want power and mileage.  Lucky for them, diesel gives you both. Diesels are known and sought after for their torque (which totally makes sense for the Wrangler) and their 20-25% better efficiency than gasoline...and don't get me going on E85...another "sexy buzz word" you might have heard about.

You go on to speak of turbocharged 4 cylinders.  I am not suggesting diesel engines to the exlusion of others.  I am saying to offer an option that has a ready-made market.  I'm saying to Chrysler not to spend thier development money chasing the next environmental trend.  I'm suggesting they use a proven and desired platform instead of questionable technology with questionable reliability.  Cost?  You want to talk Cost?  Do we even know how much the battery cells would cost to replace, and how often?

I don't have an issue with cross-compatible powertrains, per se...though the minivan engine in the current Wrangler struck a nerve with me, personally.

I am sure all of these points ARE being debated...by people who seem to not know what they're talking about. They ARE on verge of going out of business...crawling to the government to beg for money after all.

Perhaps you might want to read up on current diesel engines and update your argument for the future. You are entitled to your opinion...I just think you're wrong...just as those shmucks in Chrysler Corporate are wrong...and I know they're wrong because THEY'RE GOING BANKRUPT !!!  

You have no idea what my opinion is about diesel engines, because I didn't give one.

I'm well aware of the virtues of diesel engines. And don't forget that gasoline engines are evolving also.

How many gasoline Silverados are sold for every Duramax? How many Hemi Rams are sold for every Cummins? What about the Grand?

They're sticking their toe in the water. They're just not willing to jump in because they might drown.

My argument is not one vs. the other. Just trying to put some perspective out there.  

Both of you offer valid points.

It's true enthusiasts want a diesel, but sadly most Jeeps including Wranglers and even Wrangler Rubicons are not bought by enthusiasts and many are never even shifted into four-wheel-drive. It's a sad truth the minority (us) has to contend with.

But the perception of diesel to the typical consumer (not a Jeep enthusiast)is that diesels are dirty and stinky, regardless of what the reality is. Plus the fact of the matter is that government regulations on the required cleanliness of diesels has made the motors even more expensive and less user friendly. I'm sure technology will eventually catch up and find an easier way for the diesel to be clean besides using expensive particulate filters that reduce fuel economy and urea tanks that need so be refilled. But in the meantime everyone is pushing for electric.  

Hey while on the subject, here's something they should think about.  How about thinking along the lines of freight trains. Instead of gas/electric hybrids how about diesel/electric hybrids.. not really anything new if you know much about a freight train. Look at the amount of power and efficiency you would have. That would be the ultimate in MY oppinion that is. Just something to think about as I see it.  
'05 Rubicon, 1.25" JKS Body Lift, 1" Riser motor mounts, 265/75/16 Maxxis Bighorns.

It's funny you bring this up. You are right about the train thing, but maybe not for the right reason.

There are a lot of heavy, industrial use, diesel/electric combos. Ships and heavy haul trucks used in mining to name a few.

The reason I say it's funny, is because the reason behind the diesel/electric is the massive torque that is available from an electric motor right from 0 rpm.

This whole post started out from a guy bitching about an electric motor in the Wrangler and then goes on to say torque is why you should have a diesel.

I guess he should read up on electric motors.  

why not just build it show it to chrysler and let them do the figuring -ell were footin the bill for them anyway. ive seen dragsters runnin elec motors and diesels and dont see why a mechanically inclined person cant build either show what theyve accomplished and let them decide its kinda hard to tell someone anything and r&d people are the worst imo so build a workin prototype let them see it make it pass emission and longevity tests and give them the research veh. after you have built it if they dont like it put it on tv cram the info down their throats if you gotta but make them see the validity of your reasoning dont just whine and complain about it now it wont help your off roadin future  
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not only the founder of the white trash mafia im also a member

94 yj over the limit and out of control

I would drive the heck out of a electric jeep if,
-it could do 70 MPH.
-go around 300 miles on one charge
-and weigh the same as a normal TJ.

AKA: when the batteries get better the electric will be a very good jeep both on and off road!  

please just make a diesel pickup.  gladiator?  jeep rescue?

oh instead I have the option of compass or a commander.  Great!  
Cancel cherokee and give liberty.  
I hope 1 of the asian companies buys jeep and markets right.  

yeah cause all of those jobs should go overseas right?  
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not only the founder of the white trash mafia im also a member

94 yj over the limit and out of control

overseas?  toyotas are made in the south.  Hyundai and kia as well(not that I want either to buy)  Acura is a american car company.  What jobs?  oh the ones that are already out in mexico?  GM=flint mich Chrysler=canada.  No i want a reliable jeep with good marketing.  I want to be heard.  Not told to buy hunks o sh1t.  is it an ethical issue?  mercedes funded hitlers projects.  you think if jeep is bought by toyota or honda it would.........make a damn near perfect thing perfect.  Are you cautious now about aftermarket items you put on.  "american made"  did you throw a *** fit about the aw4 in a jeep?  

when i said overseas i was talkin bout r&d and yes i throw *** fits every time an non usa co buys an american product we shouldnt allow ourselves to get sold out just to buy a vehicle we can research and build in our country if the people in charge want to sell everything we do in this country overseas to save cost or its the best idea wed be even more piss poor as a country than we are now i understand that importing exporting veh. makes money for someone but if people in our country lose a job to it should we allow it to happen i buy and build my vehicle with american labor and parts to help our economy out but maybe im just a dumb american!! im just sayin this country is in need of more jobs not asia not germany not even mexico or canada , america needs more jobs if were going to get back where we used to sit  on the global scheme of things if we would invest in our own economy wed be better off stop sending jobs to a country other than our own i still remember when made in the usa meant something to americans but these days wed rather sell off these companies to some one else and let them make money we should be makin      


made in usa its not a slogan it is a way of life that is quickly fading away    
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not only the founder of the white trash mafia im also a member

94 yj over the limit and out of control

do like acura.  Make it an american company funded by Honda.  American made no longer applies today.  I don't say that w/ a smile either.  

If they can put a diesel in a grand then they can put one in a wrangler,cherokee,or liberty there r lots of opions on what type of fuel u run from diesel to cooking oil that most restronts give away to people here in Blairsville,Ga the u might loss 1 mpg but have the same power and its not costing you anything in fuel to go to town,movies,kids games,etc. im sure that if you put your wife in one you would rething bout not getting one for the money you would save on fuel. I live in the back woods and it bout a 20 mile drive just to the nearest wal-mart take that and figer 12 to 15 mpg in your gas burner and thien figer 20 to 25 mpg in a diesel a few times a week and till me what one you would rather drive.
 My brother has a loder Ford f-350 that he runs biodiesel hauling bobcats and track hoes and gets kick ass mpg and what it cost to make that is still less than a 1.69 a gal of regular gas.even if jeep put a regular old diesel in there rides it would help and would be a inprovment!!